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When does marriage begin between a man and a woman? PAGE 4 (Pg1, Pg2,
Pg3.)
The Forgotten Meaning?
You are on the final page where we do
our best to answer from our Lord’s point of view as he demonstrated in the
New Testament. May the God of Love, Peace and Harmony speak to your heart
as you read on. We pray that you will obey our
Lord’s words and that it will be well with you in his soon coming return
and the ushering in of his Kingdom on earth.
(all scripture taken from the KJV)
We do apologize for standing in His (Jesus) place and trying
our best to answer from his sacred lips. Our Majesty (Jesus) is above all
that we are and can think. Please note: all attempts were made to remove
any opinion from the responses that “Jesus” made.
Feel free to contact us as we welcome any challenge to any
statements made in this article. In the spirit of transparency (truth) we
will be publishing the questions/comments as they come in, as well as our
responses. This will allow the church to compare the various perspectives.
You can register (below button) to be alerted by email when the response
page is available. You can click on the “contact us” button above to send
your question/comment.
Remember the definition given for “The World’s Church” and
“God’s Church from Page 1:
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Questions & Statements
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The World’s Church response
(general answers)
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God’s Church response (THE LOGOS
SPEAKS)
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When does marriage begin between a man and a woman? Does
it begin at the end of the church service?
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When the two agree to get married, they then set a date
for a formal ceremony. And on that date of the ceremony, they will have
to sign legal documents; (legal: representing the contractual agreement).
On the date of the ceremony and only after the agreement is signed are
they considered married by most of us world churches.
Also, some of our churches may or may not recognize the
legal signing “only” and possibly treat the couple as “living in sin”,
until or after they get an official church ceremony.
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Have you not read that in the beginning made He male and
female and the two became one flesh. – Genesis 2:24.
No priest was born yet, no church building was built and
no state was established – only dominion over the earth was given to the
man by God.
When a man and a woman come together in agreement to stay
together for life and then become one flesh; they are considered married
in my Father’s eyes; The agreement is to not leave or forsake the other; as I do the same to My Church (My
Bride and my Wife). Also, as God in the old testament to Israel (his
wife) – Read the book of Hosea.
Have you not read as it is written, Abram took Hagar
(Sarai’s maid) and he took her to wife? Again, there was no ceremony, no
priest or state involvement. When Abram knew Hagar in the tent, they
became one flesh (married at that point) – Genesis 16:3
Have you not read that Isaac took Rebekah into his
mother’s tent and he knew her and she became his wife at this point. Yet
again, there was no ceremony, no priest or state involvement – Genesis
24:67
Even my servant Paul mentioned it in his letter to the
church at Corinth. After some in the church knew harlots (prostitutes), even in the absence of an agreement,
I might add, they were still becoming “one flesh”. - Corinthians 6:16
In My Fathers eyes you were created in the image of God.
Becoming one flesh is much more than two bodies coming together. After
becoming one flesh, in my own words I said,
“What God has joined together, let no man put asunder” – Matthew 19:6.
That is why it is no light thing when two people join as
one flesh. Also, remember when my servant Paul cautioned the Church
against this sin. -
1 Corinthians 6:16
In Summary (TTGM):
The “world’s church” is in error here. The result is that
they are marrying adulterers at their altars. People that have already
become one flesh with someone else and now seeking to marry another, not
knowing of this truth – Read Mark 8:38 and Hosea 4:6.
Marriage begins at becoming one flesh and not at the
pronouncement of a man or by the certification of the state. God is above
all, both state and priest (man). visit ref.
document(s) 1 and 1b.
The authority to marry or to choose not to marry was given
to the man and the woman by God. And this was from the beginning.
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets:
I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Let him that has an ear to hear, let him hear.
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If two people (man and woman) that were virgins from the
start, meet each other and decide to get married. They then both go privately
and know* each other, are they sinning in God’s eyes? (without church or
state involvement in marriage)
*Knowing (or to Know) is the correct rendering for two
people coming together (or becoming one flesh) as given by the Word
(God)
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Yes they are doing wrong in God’s eyes, It is SIN. They
are committing fornication. They are committing sexual immorality. They
need to get the official blessings of the church as well as the state’s
involvement with the legal paperwork to take care of both the spiritual
and natural side of marriage.
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No, they have not sinned in God’s eyes. The world’s church
does err on this too. Did Adam sin with Eve? Did Isaac sin with Rebekah?
No, none sinned. I did not include Abram as he was not a virgin when he
lay with Hagar. However, you might ask, did Abram sin by having a second
wife? This I will answer under another subject title.
The state was never given the authority by My Father to
decide who or when persons can get married (becoming one flesh). Control over
marriages was given to the state by the state. In time I will judge these
states/nations against my commandments and the prophets. Be patient.
visit
ref. document(s) 1b
I note that you use the word “know” or “to know” or “knew”
when becoming “one flesh”. This is indeed correct. You have kept my word
and not allowed the deceiver to deceive you to use another word that
disparages the meaning of coming together as “one flesh”. The same way a
man knows his wife, I too want to “know” my church and in turn I want my
church to “know” me.* By the way, another word that I never intended to be used by the
world church is “gay” (happy,
lighthearted and carefree). In my word, I have never called people that
practice this sinful lifestyle “gay”. I would that the world’s churches
understand that words have power in the minds of men, both to pull down
and to lift up. This “gay” word actually lifts up something that I have
called an abomination. I will forever love the person, but this practice
of men lying with men is an abomination to me and I will judge.
TTGM - You may ask what should the
word be? This will be shared in an upcoming
article called, “What every
Homosexual should know”. Register your name for updated and new
articles.
In Summary (TTGM):
If it was not a sin for two virgins to come together
privately or otherwise in the Old Testament, why would it be a sin now?
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the
prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Let him that has an ear to hear, let him hear.
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1.
Is there
scripture supporting the following: Should two virgins (male and female)
come together and know each other is this the SIN of fornication?
Follow up Question from answer 1.
2.
Yes, I understand
and agree with Ezekiel 16:26
however on the second point that you made, If a man is married to a woman
in Matthew 19:9, and she commits a sexual sin (pornea),
this allows for divorce (in God’s eyes), Why then did Jesus not use the
Greek word for adultery? Noting the Greek word for adultery is completely
different than “pornea”;
as you know the word for adultery used in the selfsame chapter and verse
is μοιχάωmoichao (moy-khah'-o).
Is not adultery the same as a wife having sex with another man? Again, if
this is the case, why then did Jesus make this distinction between pornea and moichao, could
he not just say moichao and finish the response
here? Am I missing something here?
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1.
Yes, In Ezekiel 16:26, the sin of
fornication is mentioned here. Also Jesus said in Matthew 19:9, that a man can put away his wife only after or
except it be for fornication (nothing else will allow for divorce). In other words if he (the
husband) is married to a woman and she commits fornication, he the man
can divorce her. The word used for fornication in Matthew is πορνείαporneia (por-nei'-ah).
Follow up Answer to question 2.
2.
Hmmm,
interesting, I will get back to you on this one. Will check with my world
church leaders.
We have written to twenty four ministers by email and to
date we have not received a response to the question. .
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1.
Yes, fornication is a sin, but in the context of the
question, as I said before, it is not a sin when a man and a woman come
together in a committed relationship to each other and become one flesh.
Promising not to leave or forsake each the other as I with my church (my
bride and wife). This is right in the sight of God.
--- --- ---
For me to explain the second question, I must define two
words (fornication - porneia &adultery - moichao ).
Fornication - porneia
When a man comes together with an unmarried woman (virgin)
and not intending to commit to her (leaving and forsaking her after
becoming one flesh), this is the sin
of fornication as described by my servant Paul, when some in the
church were becoming one flesh with harlots/prostitutes. Becoming one
flesh was never intended to be used this way. Another way to look at it
is that this bond should NEVER be broken after it is established between
two people. The word fornication can relate to other sexual sins, but
this definition is given in the context of a male and female
relationship.
Adultery - moichao
On the other hand the sin
of adultery is when a man knows (“have had sex” for those that have
not caught up as yet) another man’s wife.
*---*
2
Now to answer your second question, when I was speaking to
the people in the book of my servant Matthew, I was speaking primarily to
a Jewish audience. When I said that the only exception for divorce was
fornication, I meant a marriage that was not yet consummated. Or the two
had not yet become “one flesh’. You see when a man and a woman agree to
be married (become one flesh) it is seen as a binding commitment, even
more binding to what you in the west call an engagement. In fact if it is
broken off, a letter of divorce is also given as in the case of a
consummated marriage (Moses allowed this divorce by letter, not God –
Matthew 19:8). This type of union is also referred to as a betrothal. Who
I spoke to would have known what I was speaking about. This was the
context of my response.
You see if a woman is betroth to a man (or sworn to marry
a man), and then she has uncommitted knowing (sex) with a second man, she
would understand that she cannot be married to two men at the same time.
In other words, if a woman knows that she is already committed to a man
and she decides to go with different man, she knows that she cannot break
the first commitment. So she has to have uncommitted relations (knowing).
This is why I used the word fornication (porneia) or uncommitted knowing. visit ref.
document(s) 1a.
So the next question then, is there a cause for divorce if
the two persons are in a consummated relationship? The simple answer is
NO – only fornication is allowed for the two to part ways. My disciples
understood this, which is why they said that “it is good not to marry”.
They understood that there was no “escape” from such a union, so it would
have been better to stay alone. Or, their thinking was, why be in
something that may turn evil and there was no way out – Matthew 19:10
Again, you may ask, can I give an example? You are really
pressing me, but yes, I can.
Remember the story about my step Father, Joseph. He was
betrothed to the woman called Mary that I was born to in the fullness of
time. When he found out that she was with child, he could only conclude
that she fornicated (again, could not be adultery as she was not yet
consummated in marriage to Joseph – only to the Holy Ghost). So what did
he do? He was planning to put her away privately (divorce). Let me
digress here for a bit. Joseph was chosen to be my step father because he
was a man that was upright in all his ways (a just man) and followed the
commandments and the prophets all his life. At the time of finding out
about the woman’s condition, he was very hurt and he could have chosen to
put her away publicly. But given the nature of the man he was, he still
did not want to disgrace her even when he too was feeling disgraced and
embarrassed by her for what she did (he believed at the time). The angel
visited him and the rest is history.
In Summary (TTGM):
To fully understand the context of Matthew 19:9 as
described above, you will need to be familiar with the Jewish traditions
at the time. Use the tool of the internet, visit Jewish sources of
knowledge from time to time and get their perspectives and insight.
visit ref.
document(s) 1a.
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the
prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Let him that has an ear to hear, let him hear.
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If a man got married to a woman and they divorced. And
should the woman marry again to another man after the divorce, is this
sin? And if it is sin, should we as believers support the wedding? Should
this wedding be blessed by the priest/pastor?
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Well some of us world churches would not touch this couple
with a 10 foot pole if one or both were divorced and the previous spouse
is still alive based on what Jesus said in Matthew 19:9. In fact when the
disciples heard what the only reason for divorce was, they said that it
would be “good not to marry” - see
Matthew 19:10
On the other hand a number of other world churches will
welcome this couple with open arms no matter what the cause of divorce
was.
It all depends on which world church you visit. It is important
to remember that we are all under grace and we will be forgiven for all
of our sins. Not saying that we divorce with the intention to sin in
marriage to someone else, in order to move on; just saying, we will be
forgiven.
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Yes, it Is sin for
a woman to leave her husband and become one flesh with another, if the
first husband is still alive. If she does this, she is to be called an adultress all the days of her life or until the
husband before dies – read Matthew 19 1-10 and Romans 7:1-3.
Now that you know it is a sin for a woman to remarry while
the first husband is alive, do you yourself support this union as a
believer in me? Maybe you should ask, “would I the Lord support it”?
Yes, you are under grace and I will forgive, but to go
against my commandments and the prophets, only means that you are no
longer to be judged by the law (no stoning for you as in the case with
the woman caught in adultery that was brought to me – john 8:7), but you
will be judged by me at my judgment seat for your sins. Grace is no
excuse to sin. And if you now know right and continue to sin, my judgment
will be greater against you.
In Summary (TTGM):
People that are called by the name of Christ do not know
all the words of the scripture on this subject. This is because they are
not given the knowledge by the priest (Pastors, Bishops, Teachers,
Husbands {heads of the home}), they have little
or no understanding of what they are doing and the ramifications for
eternity.
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the
prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Let him that has an ear to hear, let him hear.
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Article Summary for all pages 1-4:
If you can find no fault in the
responses given by “the Word”, then you must conclude the following.
1.
Premarital sex (knowing) does not exist. How can it exist if
becoming one flesh is marriage and binding by God – Matthew 19:6
2.
In God’s eyes it's no longer called dating after the first
experience of knowing (consummation); Its
husband and wife and no man or state can change this fact. Is man greater
than God?
3.
After the world’s church and the state defined marriage to begin at
the point of the ceremony; after the year 1545 – visit ref. document(s) 1b, afterwards people naturally
thought that the sin of adultery could only occur with someone that was
part of a ceremony (or who may wear a ring). With this false
understanding, its no
wonder why Jesus would refer on his return to an adulterous and sinful
generation/people (in times past and more so now) - Mark 8:38. Its also interesting to note
that since adultery is sin, why would our Lord separate out adultery in
Mark 8:38. Why did he not lump it all together and just say sinful
generation only? Something for you to ponder on. HINT: maybe it is so
evil and RAMPANT that He gave it special attention.
4.
The definition of fornication prior to
year 1545 was to have uncommitted knowing with someone (or lying with
someone with no intention to stay in the relationship). After the year
1545 the definition of fornication changed to knowing (or lying with)
someone before the “church/state” ceremony of marriage. Putting it
another way, after 1545 if two people “lived” together, had children
together
and were committed to each other, they were now defined by the world’s
church as “living in sin” or living in fornication (because there was no
official ceremony or signing of documents). Before the famous meeting in
1545, it was accepted by the then church that people that “lived
together” were man and wife. This would have been in agreement with the
Biblical principle as demonstrated by the three examples given by TTGM
“Jesus”. In short the church got it right prior to 1545 (man got it wrong
after 1545).
5.
A couple that visits a world church and “live together” are not
living in sin if they never gone through a ceremony and a “blessing”.
They are just as married as the person that had a ceremony (or more so;
they may have started out being both virgins in their relationship) – as
was the case before 1545 visit ref. document(s) 1b . Should Isaac and Rebekah come back to
live again and visit a church, will their marriage in the tent be
recognized? God recognized it by calling Rebekah, Isaac’s wife. Who has
the higher authority? God or the world’s Church?
6.
Divorced women that enter into a second knowing (one flesh
relationship), do so by the sin of adultery.
7.
The Greek word for “marriage” is “gamos”
(γάμος). The Greek
word for sexual intercourse* is
“gamo” (γαμώ).
Based on the word construction, both Gamos and Gamo have a shared
meaning.
8.
Even the meaning of the word “bastard” that we use in modern day
English is different in the context of marriage. The modern day meaning
given to bastard is, a person born to parents that are not
"married". However, the Hebrew meaning to the word bastard (H4464 מַמזֵר mamzer) is a person born to a
Jewish man that lies with a heathen mother (a non-Jewish woman). In other
words if the parents of a person were both Jews the person would not be
called a bastard (the term simply would not apply). Again, nothing to do
with marriage, since marriage is Gamos (see item 7).
9.
You may have noticed that we have focused on the women committing
adultery more so than the man. This is done purposely because it is in
keeping with what the Word of God teaches. This will be discussed further
in another titled article that is soon to be published. We encourage you
to register your email with us to get updates to this article as well as
others to come.
Now that
you have read the complete four page article, the following verses from
the book of Matthew and Mark should come as no surprise.
[Matthew 7:21-27]
21 Not everyone that saith unto
me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of
my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day,
Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and
in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful
works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you:
depart from me, ye that work iniquity. 24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will
liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25 And
the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon
that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26 And
every one that heareth these sayings of mine,
and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his
house upon the sand: 27 And the rain descended, and the floods came,
and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was
the fall of it.
[Matthew 15:9]
But in vain they do worship me,
teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
[Mark 8:38]
38 Whosoever
therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words (from the Logos)in this adulterous
and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of
his Father with the holy angels.
“Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the
prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.”
*The English word for “Gamo” is
really “fu.k**” and not sexual intercourse
(means the same thing). Go to
Google and use search string “the Greek word for marriage”, and then
search string “the Greek word for fu.k”.
** - fu.k is not a cuss word to describe
“sex”, it was a word used since the 1500s. Hollywood has helped to
distort this word like so many others.
WE AT TTGM STAND READY TO ANSWER ANYONE THAT
DISAGREES WITH THE STATED CONCLUSION OF THIS ARTICLE. WE WILL ALSO PUBLISH
YOUR ARGUMENTS ON THIS WEBSITE
MINISTERS OF THE GOSPEL ARE ESPECIALLY WELCOMED
TO CONTACT US
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This article was written to share the truth of God’s Word to
the church as it relates to when marriage between a man and a woman begins.
When the church truly teaches, “it is written”, then we stand with them on
the side of Truth. It is and has been a very controversial subject for the
researcher/writer of these pages, but our Lord was not one to shun
controversy. He was not one to seek the favor of men; for Him TRUTH came
before life and for Truth he died. Are you prepared to die for the Truth?
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TTGM
PUBLICATION:
Be no
longer deceived, we invite you to read "It is TRUTH". Be prepared in truth
before it is your turn to go onto the other side.
This book touches
on a number of critical subjects that are taught in Christendom and it shows
how man's deception has twisted the word of God. If you want to worship God
and follow Jesus (Yeshua) in spirit and in TRUTH, this book is for you. In
reading the book I pray you understand God's word as God intended.
This book is also fact-based. Evidence to support what is stated will be
shown both biblically and historically by links and references to
authoritative sources.
Contents include the following:
The commandments and the Torah | Deception in the church
Why would iniquity keep you out of Heaven? | Are you in God’s will?
Do you have the heart of an adulterer? | Are you thinking marriage?
What is true marriage? | Is polygamy sin in the eyes of God?
The right and wrong way to become one flesh and much more.
To get your free copy go to LuLu
To support our Ministry buy
the
Kindle ebook from Amazon ($0.99 USD)
- Paperback is also available. You can also give away this book as a
gift to family and friends.
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The Greatest Love of all (John 3:16)
"For God so
loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever
believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life"
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